Dwi/dui??

[cowpoke]

OR ANY other REVENUE Enhancement State Programs????

I heard a great program on Jason Lewis a few weeks ago about the Way that State and Local law enforcement have run amok with the .08 BS level.

When people are pulled over for having even 1 Drink, they go out of their way to try and ruin your pocket book if you have something to take.

MADD has to be stopped. These NON PROFITS like MADD NEED AN AGENDA..

They show the wrecked car ect.. claim the EVIL DRUNK Driver causes all sorts of EVIL and wallah.

This Gestapo style tactics of you had a couple drinks and the cop follows you from the bar and then CLAIMS....YOU WERE SWERVING HAS TO STOP...

I propose DAM.. Drivers Against Madd..

They have their Jihad Against Smokers and Their Jihad against people who have a few glasses of wine with their meals..

WAKE UP PEOPLE and fight back..

If you are caught in their revenue enhancement web, you are toast if you have something to take.

Pretty soon, if you have a sip of liqueur, they will try and ruin your lives..

[dilligaf]

I'm not so sure I agree with you stance on MADD.
Tho just like the other end of this equation, it is too extreme.

DUI is flat out the way they finance the department here.
Close Main St., open container, have a 10 hour concert drunk fest....
then have the cops sit at every artery in and out of town.

As a bailbondschick, I see it on a regular basis.
80% of my bonds are DUI's..
and yea, I've bailed out the 63 yr. old nice lady who had two glasses of wine with dinner.

I have been intimately affected on both sides....
I prefer the middle.

On most everything I guess.:thinking:

[JPmonopoly]

it will be .05 soon, then in a few years the militants will start crying for .02, then 0

soon we will be required to wear helmets and chest protectors while in a vehicle as well

its known as the Samer theory "the whole world is cracking up"

IAO!

[Wolverine]

I hear they've passed a temporary ordinance to allow D.C. bars to stay open until 5 am during Obama week , hopefully they are prepared for lots of arrests , anyone that voted for Obama should be field sobriety tested & booked accordingly................

[Wolverine]

Breathalyzer is the single largest infringement of citizen's rights in existence. NEVER, and I mean NEVER blow, I don't care if you have never taken a drink of an alcoholic beverage in your entire life ! They are proven EXTREMELY inaccurate and anything can show a false positive, fruit juice, toothpaste, cigarettes, you name it, and once you've shown to be intoxicated , it WILL stand up in court , so you are basically screwed. They entice you to blow by threatening license suspension for refusal but you are still better off not blowing no matter what. If you are convinced of your own sobriety , demand a blood test by an independent medical facility !!!
:wait::smoke:

[Daddy Needs Mils]

OR ANY other REVENUE Enhancement State Programs????

I heard a great program on Jason Lewis a few weeks ago about the Way that State and Local law enforcement have run amok with the .08 BS level.

When people are pulled over for having even 1 Drink, they go out of their way to try and ruin your pocket book if you have something to take.

MADD has to be stopped. These NON PROFITS like MADD NEED AN AGENDA..

They show the wrecked car ect.. claim the EVIL DRUNK Driver causes all sorts of EVIL and wallah.

This Gestapo style tactics of you had a couple drinks and the cop follows you from the bar and then CLAIMS....YOU WERE SWERVING HAS TO STOP...

I propose DAM.. Drivers Against Madd..

They have their Jihad Against Smokers and Their Jihad against people who have a few glasses of wine with their meals..

WAKE UP PEOPLE and fight back..

If you are caught in their revenue enhancement web, you are toast if you have something to take.

Pretty soon, if you have a sip of liqueur, they will try and ruin your lives..


Now I understand why Minnesota can build a new Interstate bridge for about $250 mil, and a bridge in Portland, less than half the size is bid at $4.2 BILLION!:headbang::headbang:And none of our politicians are even from Chicago.:punch:

Sorry about the DUII, my friend, but it's cheaper for you to pay for that than my portion of our bridges.:tongueout:


I hear they've passed a temporary ordinance to allow D.C. bars to stay open until 5 am during Obama week , hopefully they are prepared for lots of arrests , anyone that voted for Obama should be field sobriety tested & booked accordingly................

You are kidding me, right?

Obamites will get a pass just like he does on everything. It's prearranged---take that to the bank.

[Wolverine]

You are kidding me, right?

Obamites will get a pass just like he does on everything. It's prearranged---take that to the bank.

I am certain you are correct but I can still wish ill will upon the lot of them !!!
:giggle:

[Daddy Needs Mils]

I am certain you are correct but I can still wish ill will upon the lot of them !!!
:giggle:

That will be saved for the picketers

[Daddy Needs Mils]

Breathalyzer is the single largest infringement of citizen's rights in existence. NEVER, and I mean NEVER blow, I don't care if you have never taken a drink of an alcoholic beverage in your entire life ! They are proven EXTREMELY inaccurate and anything can show a false positive, fruit juice, toothpaste, cigarettes, you name it, and once you've shown to be intoxicated , it WILL stand up in court , so you are basically screwed. They entice you to blow by threatening license suspension for refusal but you are still better off not blowing no matter what. If you are convinced of your own sobriety , demand a blood test by an independent medical facility !!!
:wait::smoke:

I am not 100% certain, but I heard in Oregon, they were going to go to the same kind of swabs that they use for drub screens for employment.

Deadly accurate, and in only about 3 minutes.

[jcav]

I guess you never had a loved one killed by a drunk driver. Or, you never pulled a dead body out of a car who was killed by a drunk. Or you never went to an autopsy of a person killed by a drunk driver. Or, you never had to ring the door bell and tell a mother and father that their son/daughter was killed by a drunk driver. When you do, you will change your stance. JCAV

[AZDinar]

Breathalyzer is the single largest infringement of citizen's rights in existence. NEVER, and I mean NEVER blow, I don't care if you have never taken a drink of an alcoholic beverage in your entire life ! They are proven EXTREMELY inaccurate and anything can show a false positive, fruit juice, toothpaste, cigarettes, you name it, and once you've shown to be intoxicated , it WILL stand up in court , so you are basically screwed. They entice you to blow by threatening license suspension for refusal but you are still better off not blowing no matter what. If you are convinced of your own sobriety , demand a blood test by an independent medical facility !!!
:wait::smoke:

I can tell you first hand that the whole DUI racket as being perpetrated upon the public now is a money scam. The breathalizers are inaccurate and can be defeated in court, but in the end, the laws are against you. While people think that .08 is the magic number to beat, most States have laws that state it is illegal to drive with a BAC of .08 or impaired to the slightest degree. It's those words that will nail you. Doesn't matter if you blow a .02 - if the cop testifies that you were impaired in his opinion, you are guilty of DUI. I had that happen to me. BAC tests were shown to be inaccurate, police reports written at the time of the incident stated my demeanor was normal, my appearance was normal, but according to the cops, I failed the FST's (field sobriety tests). Never mind that I had just come from an accident where I had gotten a concussion only moments before - the cops tried to hide that fact. Never mind that in court, my lawyer showed that the cops testifying against me contradicted their own report over and over again (i.e. they lied on the witness stand), in their effort to put me in a bad light to the jury.

Here's the bottom line. NEVER take the FST's. It is your right to refuse, and the purpose of those tests is to CONVICT you, period. The FST's is only used for the police to collect evidence against you, and you can politely refuse to take them. Taking them will not change what is going to happen to you that evening, it will only give the police evidence to use against you. DUI is a money making racket, and the police are experts at it.

If you get pulled over for DUI, here's my advice. Say very little, except what is required from you. Don't answer any questions about your activity that night (Have you been drinking? How many drinks did you have?). Do not take the FST's. They are not mandated by law, and there are MANY reasons why you could fail them that your attorney will know about. Politely refuse to take the tests. In my State, to refuse a breathalizer is an automatic suspension of your license to drive for 6 months, and does not stop the police from continuing to charge you with DUI. I say, take the breathalizer test, and then request a private sample to be taken and sealed for independent analysis. That is your right to have that done. That will likely get the breathalizer evidence thrown out, if the two samples do not match exactly. And lastly, GET A LAWYER, GET A LAWYER, GET A GOOD LAWYER. You need an aggressive attorney that knows all the tricks the prosecutor will use against you. You are dealing with experts in getting convictions, you need an equal expert to refute the evidence.

If you get pulled over, it's gonna cost you money, plain and simple. There will be no getting over that. Your decision will be who that money goes to - your lawyer, or the State, and what eventually will go on your record. If you EVER go out and have a drink, it may be wise to contact a competent attorney NOW and review what is required for conviction in the State you are in. They will give you the best advice as to what to do if you are pulled over.

[Howler]

Breathalyzer is the single largest infringement of citizen's rights in existence. NEVER, and I mean NEVER blow, I don't care if you have never taken a drink of an alcoholic beverage in your entire life ! They are proven EXTREMELY inaccurate and anything can show a false positive, fruit juice, toothpaste, cigarettes, you name it, and once you've shown to be intoxicated , it WILL stand up in court , so you are basically screwed. They entice you to blow by threatening license suspension for refusal but you are still better off not blowing no matter what. If you are convinced of your own sobriety , demand a blood test by an independent medical facility !!!
:wait::smoke:



Bad advice there buddy.
Having spent most of my drinking life in Illinois, I was always told by lawyers (locker room, and real) to never blow. And they were right.

BUT down here in slippery poop Kentucky they have gotten around that by making every suspected intoxicated driver that doesnt blow a FELONY DUI!
Fines and penalties go up accordingly.

I've seen some horrific wrecks caused by drunk drivers, so I'm pretty against anyone drinking and getting behind the wheel. But we have only ourselves to blame.

Where I grew up On the SW side of Chicago, all the neighborhoods had their own Taverns. It was a great place to go after work, have some drinks, and something to eat. It was the social hub for the neighborhood. Then all the do gooders started complaining, and soon all the the bars within a certain distance to living areas were closed. No more walking to the bar, you had to drive, and open your self up to Jonny Law.

[Dakota77]

I'm not so sure I agree with you stance on MADD.
Tho just like the other end of this equation, it is too extreme.

DUI is flat out the way they finance the department here.
Close Main St., open container, have a 10 hour concert drunk fest....
then have the cops sit at every artery in and out of town.

As a bailbondschick, I see it on a regular basis.
80% of my bonds are DUI's..
and yea, I've bailed out the 63 yr. old nice lady who had two glasses of wine with dinner.

I have been intimately affected on both sides....
I prefer the middle.
On most everything I guess.:thinking:
How true! Then they say there is NO ENTRAPMENT!!!:rolleyes::headbang:

[JUSTAGIRL]

I'm not so sure I agree with you stance on MADD.
Tho just like the other end of this equation, it is too extreme.

DUI is flat out the way they finance the department here.
Close Main St., open container, have a 10 hour concert drunk fest....
then have the cops sit at every artery in and out of town.

As a bailbondschick, I see it on a regular basis.
80% of my bonds are DUI's..
and yea, I've bailed out the 63 yr. old nice lady who had two glasses of wine with dinner.

I have been intimately affected on both sides....
I prefer the middle.

On most everything I guess.:thinking:

Ok - so then where is "the middle". Come on, commit. You had your say, now what is the fix? My Daddy said it was politicised under the guise of getting tough on crime to go from 1.0 BAC to .08 BAC. NEVER MIND GOING AFTER REAL CRIMINALS. So now we have all types of people going to jail, not just people with drinking problem who drive. But the government buerocrats like the extra income, never mind the damage done to the individual driving a few blocks home from the local tavern with a BAC of .08. (Have a friend who this stupidity happened to). If the politicians were honest, they would at least change the law back to 1.0 and undo the damage done to the .08 victims. But that ain't gonna happen, is it? - JMDO - :headbang:JAG:no::headbang::headbang:

[geowhiz]

In Sublette County Wyoming you can still get a shot to go at a drive up liquor store. (Not that I would do such a thing).

[RotaryRevn]

Wow, there's soo much FALSE info on this thread it's not even funny. If any of you had ever seen even 1 percent of the dead people I have that were either killed by drunk drivers or killed themselves driving drunk, or had to tell the family of someone that there loved one was killed by a drunk driver, you would change your tunes in a heartbeat.

[dilligaf]

Ok - so then where is "the middle". Come on, commit. You had your say, now what is the fix? My Daddy said it was politicised under the guise of getting tough on crime to go from 1.0 BAC to .08 BAC. NEVER MIND GOING AFTER REAL CRIMINALS. So now we have all types of people going to jail, not just people with drinking problem who drive. But the government buerocrats like the extra income, never mind the damage done to the individual driving a few blocks home from the local tavern with a BAC of .08. (Have a friend who this stupidity happened to). If the politicians were honest, they would at least change the law back to 1.0 and undo the damage done to the .08 victims. But that ain't gonna happen, is it? - JMDO - :headbang:JAG:no::headbang::headbang:
Well JAG.....
MY DADDY raised a very non-committal, middle of the road, happy-go-lucky, kind of gal. The 'middle' for me is:

I lost my best friend to a drunk driver and it pisses me off to this day.

My husband has 2 DUI's over 10 years, neither of which were 'legit', but hey fella....they don't like 'rolling stops' either.

I bail people out all the time who were borderline, and simply in the wrong place at the wrong time.....just BARELY doing the wrong thing.

The 'middle'?? I don't drink and drive, cause if you do..you will lose, one way or another. I am passionate about many things, but taking on 'Po-Po',
not a wise battle. It is much easier for me to obey law.

Tell YOUR DADDY, that I look for and enjoy his opinions on all topics.
In the end...we're all JUST A GIRL.:hi:

[cowpoke]

Wow, there's soo much FALSE info on this thread it's not even funny. If any of you had ever seen even 1 percent of the dead people I have that were either killed by drunk drivers or killed themselves driving drunk, or had to tell the family of someone that there loved one was killed by a drunk driver, you would change your tunes in a heartbeat.

RR, the point here is that the Legal system has been used by rogue Non Profits in the name of safety to create a Jihad against normal law abidding citizens.
This Nanny State Mentality of controlling peoples lives by manipulating laws is out of hand.....

IF IN FACT SAFTY AS THE TRUE CONCERN, Then why are
STONE COLD SOBER Drivers the NUMBER ONE cause of accidents by being distracted??

1. Distracted Drivers

Mark Edwards, Director of Traffic Safety at the American Automobile Association stated, "The research tells us that somewhere between 25-50 percent of all motor vehicle crashes in this country really have driver distraction as their root cause."

The distractions are many, but according to a study conducted by the Virginia Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) and Virginia Commonwealth University (VCU), rubbernecking -- or slowing down to gawk at another accident -- caused the most accidents, accounting for 16 percent of all distraction-related crashes.

WHY are these people not demonized and put through the ringer IN THE NAME OF SAFETY??:confused:

2. Driver Fatigue

Drowsy drivers account for about 100,000 accidents every year in the United States, according to the U.S. National Traffic Safety Administration. The risk is greatest from 11 p.m. to 8 a.m., the time when most people are used to sleeping, however some people also become drowsy from noon to 2 p.m.

Why are we not throwing the book at tired people??:confused:

[VonWeeden]

OR ANY other REVENUE Enhancement State Programs????

I heard a great program on Jason Lewis a few weeks ago about the Way that State and Local law enforcement have run amok with the .08 BS level.

When people are pulled over for having even 1 Drink, they go out of their way to try and ruin your pocket book if you have something to take.

MADD has to be stopped. These NON PROFITS like MADD NEED AN AGENDA..

They show the wrecked car ect.. claim the EVIL DRUNK Driver causes all sorts of EVIL and wallah.

This Gestapo style tactics of you had a couple drinks and the cop follows you from the bar and then CLAIMS....YOU WERE SWERVING HAS TO STOP...

I propose DAM.. Drivers Against Madd..

They have their Jihad Against Smokers and Their Jihad against people who have a few glasses of wine with their meals..

WAKE UP PEOPLE and fight back..

If you are caught in their revenue enhancement web, you are toast if you have something to take.

Pretty soon, if you have a sip of liqueur, they will try and ruin your lives..

Im with you Cowpoke. As the recipient of 4 DUI's, enough is enough....:giggle:

[Rainman998]

Wow, there's soo much FALSE info on this thread it's not even funny. If any of you had ever seen even 1 percent of the dead people I have that were either killed by drunk drivers or killed themselves driving drunk, or had to tell the family of someone that there loved one was killed by a drunk driver, you would change your tunes in a heartbeat.



TOTALLY AGREED!!! Grow up people drunk drivers kill I have seen it and I have put them in jail. And by the way majority of the DUI arrests I have made have been to people over 0.15 BAC or DUI Drugs. You don't have to perform standardized field sobriety tests but in Arizona its your choice. If you don't want to give a breath sample you don't have too I will just submit the paperwork to suspend your license for 1 year. I will then write a search warrant and have a nurse or another cop who is a phlebotomist and we will take your blood.

Bottom line is its your choice to drink and drive and if you want to get some lowlife defense attorney its your right but remember when you are convicted and have to pay your fines and an attorney bill; you could have avoided it because its cheaper to call a cab or call a friend.

Maybe I am just jaded but if you had to do CPR on a fourteen year old girl for ten minutes because some person just wanted one more drink just to find out later that no matter what you did she still would have died because of a massive hematoma in her brain made her brain dead you would feel the same way I do. And by the way the drunk was just a 0.09 that "Fell asleep behind the wheel" and he lived and showed no remorse because it was "just an accident." And wow he had been arrested for DUI before evidentally he did not learn.

And by the way the Intoxylizer 8000 system that is the prefferred calibrated breathalizer by most of the United States Law Enforcement only picks up alcohol, not all of the stuff listed above.

If I was wrong maybe a jury of their peers would have seen that I did not have enough evidence to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. I arrest the courts convict.

Call your local police agency and ask to go on a ride along so you can see the death notifications and DUI accidents yourself. And if you have been arrested for DUI be thankful you did not kill anyone or yourself. The DUI fines are high to detur people from taking the risk and eventhough in AZ we have the impaired to the slightest degree violation the County Attorney will not charge unless the suspect is over 0.05 BAC.

You are not informed.

[Wolverine]

Wow, there's soo much FALSE info on this thread it's not even funny. If any of you had ever seen even 1 percent of the dead people I have that were either killed by drunk drivers or killed themselves driving drunk, or had to tell the family of someone that there loved one was killed by a drunk driver, you would change your tunes in a heartbeat.

I have lost family and friends to drunk drivers. If you want to see an example of exceptionally lax DUI/DWI laws, have a look at all the crosses that virtually line the public roadways in Montana. I am not condoning driving drunk but rather pointing out law enforcement run amok .

I'll repeat, if stopped by law enforcement in Texas , even if you DO NOT drink and /or have never touched a drop.....if you choose to fully cooperate (i.e. submit a breath specimen and do their stupid human tricks) you stand an extremely good chance of being arrested AND CONVICTED of crime that you are not guilty of.

[JUSTAGIRL]

Well JAG.....
MY DADDY raised a very non-committal, middle of the road, happy-go-lucky, kind of gal. The 'middle' for me is:

I lost my best friend to a drunk driver and it pisses me off to this day.

My husband has 2 DUI's over 10 years, neither of which were 'legit', but hey fella....they don't like 'rolling stops' either.

I bail people out all the time who were borderline, and simply in the wrong place at the wrong time.....just BARELY doing the wrong thing.

The 'middle'?? I don't drink and drive, cause if you do..you will lose, one way or another. I am passionate about many things, but taking on 'Po-Po',
not a wise battle. It is much easier for me to obey law.

Tell YOUR DADDY, that I look for and enjoy his opinions on all topics.
In the end...we're all JUST A GIRL.:hi:

Point is then, where to draw the line, correct? You haven't done that yet. Sounds like if the idiots in the Government brought back PROHIBITION, you would be for that because"it's the law". Try again. - JMDO - JAG

[cowpoke]

A friend of my wife lost her 18 yo daughter last year. The teenage girl that hit and killed her was on her cell phone.

Would you feel safer on a road full people on their cell phones

or full of people who had 2 drinks?

[Daddy Needs Mils]

A friend of my wife lost her 18 yo daughter last year. The teenage girl that hit and killed her was on her cell phone.

Would you feel safer on a road full people on their cell phones

or full of people who had 2 drinks?

The most dangerous drivers on the road are 18-24 year old women on cell phones. :fubar:

They change lanes in the middle of intersections without once looking. They blow stop signs, and lights. Always makes me wish I was driving my old ranch truck and run them off the road.

The guy that just had a lonely beer is far more cautious

[geowhiz]

Im with you Cowpoke. As the recipient of 4 DUI's, enough is enough....:giggle:

Been pulled over and had to do the tests about 10 times, always for some lame cop excuse (too slow, too fast, crossed the fog line, etc). Never had a DUI (exceptional dexterity and motor skills). One night was pulled over on the Navajo Res in Arizona tripping balls on the way to some canyon in Utah. Funny story tho.. but still nothing they could pin on us. One time after a Dead show in Las Vegas the cops had a line of VW minibuses pulled over searching every single freak for drugs. Nevada cops=assholes.

The only time I was truly a menace on the roadways and almost ran head-on into a car? Texting my wife and a stupid deer ran in front of me. Worst accident? Motorcycle spill on the way to class.

Cellphones bad. Motorcycles? Extra precaution.. A couple of drinks.. Just fine. Cops?? Dont even go there. Sorry Copper.


BTW the most horrendous accident Ive been indirectly a part of? Carload of roughnecks going on day's off after working their 12 hour tour at the end of their hitch, flipped over at 7:00 in the morning on the way back home, killing 5 young men with families. The reason? The sunrise was coming over the horizon and the driver was blinded, combined with being tired after the evening at work. Goes to prove that all "bad driving" is relative to the situation.

DUI loving cops can kiss my .

[Stuck@Cedar]

...I propose DAM.. Drivers Against Madd...

I always thought DAM was for Mothers Against Dyslexia! :yelrotflmao:

[believethis]

How about this, don't drink and drive. What the F is the issue about? DUI... Don't DUI... and/or don't live in ridiculously ignorant places like TX and 'slippery poop' kentucky. Up north, no one gets pulled over for "nothing" and stuck with something (a conviction)... guess the cops here are different. Just don't drink and drive... Hope you aren't serious Von about the 4 DUI's...

I've been driving for 16 years now, know how many times I've been pulled over, for anything, how about three times, all three speeding (not that fast either, like 73 in a 65)... 2 resulted in warnings and the other a ticket. I'm not claiming to be an angel on/off the road, just saying, don't do REALLY DUMB things like DUI/DWI PERIOD Why risk your own life and MORE IMPORTANTLY, the lives of the ones you love and the lives of perfect strangers around you on the road, even if it is for 1 - 2 blocks. Ignorant way of thinking about DUI... so ignorant...

[Daddy Needs Mils]

http://dui.drivinglaws.org/calc.php

DUI calculator for getting an estimate on how you should be able to do.

I wonder if you can use this calculator's results since it is a somewhat sanctioned state DUII law site.

Just a thought. Any good lawyers----sorry I asked that here? How about experienced?

[Wolverine]

How about this, don't drink and drive. What the F is the issue about? DUI... Don't DUI... and/or don't live in ridiculously ignorant places like TX and 'slippery poop' kentucky. Up north, no one gets pulled over for "nothing" and stuck with something (a conviction)... guess the cops here are different. Just don't drink and drive... Hope you aren't serious Von about the 4 DUI's...

I've been driving for 16 years now, know how many times I've been pulled over, for anything, how about three times, all three speeding (not that fast either, like 73 in a 65)... 2 resulted in warnings and the other a ticket. I'm not claiming to be an angel on/off the road, just saying, don't do REALLY DUMB things like DUI/DWI PERIOD Why risk your own life and MORE IMPORTANTLY, the lives of the ones you love and the lives of perfect strangers around you on the road, even if it is for 1 - 2 blocks. Ignorant way of thinking about DUI... so ignorant...

If you have never been pulled over for "nothing" and stuck with something, consider yourself fortunate. It does happen and increasingly more than it should, that is more what this thread is about , our ever eroding rights as citizens !

[dilligaf]

Point is then, where to draw the line, correct? You haven't done that yet. Sounds like if the idiots in the Government brought back PROHIBITION, you would be for that because"it's the law". Try again. - JMDO - JAG
JAG- I truly hope you haven't chosen me as this weeks Debate Class project, cause you're bound for a failing grade if that is the case. In an effort to boost you up on that ole' Bell curve...I'll counter your point in red.

Nowhere did I say I was 'for' the current DUI levels because they were law. I did say I find it in my own best interest, for obvious reasons to me anyway, to abide by that particular law.

I can 'draw the line' anywhere I want. Tho that may get you a better Debate grade, it doesn't making a flipping bit of difference to the officer placing me under arrest.

We can agree that there are idiots in Government, my observation there is that they are elected idiots.

In my last homage to your very cool MO...

MY DADDY SAYS...Change what you can, accept what you cannot, and try to have the wisdom to know the difference. It's always worked well for me.

[Kevmo]

Reducing the threshhold for a DUI to .08 is pure political b.s. The reason is that opponents have a lobby and the average person does not. American is governed on the principal of hecklers veto. Those who feel disenfranchised or otherwise have an axe to grind with mainstream America realized long ago that they can get their way by banding together and purchasing people that would sell their soul for a dollar, politicians.

However, anyone can get out of a DUI if that is what they want. First, get a lawyer that defends drunk drivers. Second, don't about the fee. Its going to cost, big time. Eight to ten thousand dollars. But, for that you get expert witnesses that will rebut the verasity of PBT's, breathalyzers, whatever. The reason? Unless you're on your third DUI and its a felony, you will be in a lower court being prosecuted by a City Attorney, not the county prosecutors office. They don't have the budget to counter your witnesses. Do not agree to a bench trial where the Judge makes the final determination, leave it up to a jury. After your witnesses testify without rebuttal by the prosecution, you'll walk. With all of the fines, costs, AA meetings, victim impact meetings, license suspension, extortionate insurance rates etc., its money well spent.

Another point, don't be bamboozled when politicians propose secondary offenses, like seatbelt laws. They always become primary offenses. Cell phones are in the crosshairs now. If your state passes a restriction on them as a secondary offense, it will only be a year or two and you'll see cops staked out on the side of the road watching for people on their phones and nailing them. Usually at the end of the month when they're on a last minute fund raising campaign for the municipalities.

I'm in no way bashing cops. They only enforce the b.s. laws passed by politicians; the real problem with America.

[johnruseckas]

Years ago, US Air Force friends of mine attempted to add some checks and balances to the above well described out of control government descent into tyranny and corruption directed against the average already well put upon driving citizen. The answer was DAMM (Drunks against Mad Mothers).

I don't have statistics to demonstrate whether the effort had any measurable success, but it at least added some humor to the miserableness of the overall situation.

John, Arizona

[cowpoke]

Reducing the threshhold for a DUI to .08 is pure political b.s. The reason is that opponents have a lobby and the average person does not. American is governed on the principal of hecklers veto. Those who feel disenfranchised or otherwise have an axe to grind with mainstream America realized long ago that they can get their way by banding together and purchasing people that would sell their soul for a dollar, politicians.

However, anyone can get out of a DUI if that is what they want. First, get a lawyer that defends drunk drivers. Second, don't about the fee. Its going to cost, big time. Eight to ten thousand dollars. But, for that you get expert witnesses that will rebut the verasity of PBT's, breathalyzers, whatever. The reason? Unless you're on your third DUI and its a felony, you will be in a lower court being prosecuted by a City Attorney, not the county prosecutors office. They don't have the budget to counter your witnesses. Do not agree to a bench trial where the Judge makes the final determination, leave it up to a jury. After your witnesses testify without rebuttal by the prosecution, you'll walk. With all of the fines, costs, AA meetings, victim impact meetings, license suspension, extortionate insurance rates etc., its money well spent.

Another point, don't be bamboozled when politicians propose secondary offenses, like seatbelt laws. They always become primary offenses. Cell phones are in the crosshairs now. If your state passes a restriction on them as a secondary offense, it will only be a year or two and you'll see cops staked out on the side of the road watching for people on their phones and nailing them. Usually at the end of the month when they're on a last minute fund raising campaign for the municipalities.

I'm in no way bashing cops. They only enforce the b.s. laws passed by politicians; the real problem with America.

Great points Kev, I think that a movement could gain momentum. Heck, think about it.
If you get a DW, you are basically screwed for thousands of dollars. Well, then what the heck does it matter if you spend fifty bucks to join a Non Profit like a DAM (Drivers against Madd)

Just look at how they play the numbers game.:
http://www.madd.org/Drunk-Driving/Drunk-Driving/Statistics/AllStats.aspx#STAT_1

They won't single out a particular year, instead the use multiple years for each talking point. WHY?? BECAUSE THAT YEARS STATS FIT THEIR AGENDA..

WAKE UP PEOPLE, otherwise you will be arrested for having pink flamingo lawn ornaments..


This system is out of control. I am sick and tired of the only way we solve issues is by making laws so tight that people are literally held hostage and all by themselves in the system against the man.

IF IN FACT we are really trying to protect society, why then don't we use the so called SIN taxes on Booze to actually HELP SOCIETY.

Lets see, if we used the taxes on liquer to actually pay for free cab rides home, that would save BILLIONS of dollars and THOUSANDS of lives..

But that makes to much sense.. Get the point folks?

[JUSTAGIRL]

JAG- I truly hope you haven't chosen me as this weeks Debate Class project, cause you're bound for a failing grade if that is the case. In an effort to boost you up on that ole' Bell curve...I'll counter your point in red.

Nowhere did I say I was 'for' the current DUI levels because they were law. I did say I find it in my own best interest, for obvious reasons to me anyway, to abide by that particular law.

I can 'draw the line' anywhere I want. Tho that may get you a better Debate grade, it doesn't making a flipping bit of difference to the officer placing me under arrest.

We can agree that there are idiots in Government, my observation there is that they are elected idiots.

In my last homage to your very cool MO...

MY DADDY SAYS...Change what you can, accept what you cannot, and try to have the wisdom to know the difference. It's always worked well for me.

Thanks for the reply. But what i get out of this is you are not the type to fight back against out of control government. That is what this thread is actually about - pointing out the flawed, short sighted DUI/ DWI/ 502 "system". Our family believes in the Constitution, and our BILL OF RIGHTS. We also understand the warnings given to us, the inheritors of this Nation, by it's FOUNDING FATHERS. WARNINGS that predict the downfall of our once great system of LIBERTY and JUSTICE FOR ALL - IF WE IGNORE THE WARNING SIGNS. There are many obvious "signs" of this said decay happening right now. It is up to us, WE THE PEOPLE, TO BE VIGILANT and FIGHT BACK. THERE ARE FIGHTERS, and then there are those who simply do nothing and stand on the sidelines while their rights slowly disappear. Which are YOU? - JAG

[irons]

Another thing you fine folks in the rest of the US can get used to as the national economy tanks is rabid cops.
We are used to them here in Nojobistan, as tax revenues dry up the cops are literally arresting to save thier own jobs.
Nice thought, huh?
Gov whiffleball of michigan has given us a 6 year head start on the mess the rest of the US will be in soon.
Have Fun!! :wave:

[cowpoke]

Thanks for the reply. But what i get out of this is you are not the type to fight back against out of control government. That is what this thread is actually about - pointing out the flawed, short sighted DUI/ DWI/ 502 "system". Our family believes in the Constitution, and our BILL OF RIGHTS. We also understand the warnings given to us, the inheritors of this Nation, by it's FOUNDING FATHERS. WARNINGS that predict the downfall of our once great system of LIBERTY and JUSTICE FOR ALL - IF WE IGNORE THE WARNING SIGNS. There are many obvious "signs" of this said decay happening right now. It is up to us, WE THE PEOPLE, TO BE VIGILANT and FIGHT BACK. THERE ARE FIGHTERS, and then there are those who simply do nothing and stand on the sidelines while their rights slowly disappear. Which are YOU? - JAG

THAT WAS JUST DOWN RIGHT INSPIRATIONAL. :handshake:
JAG, you are a modern day Deborah Sampson....:yes:

[JUSTAGIRL]

THAT WAS JUST DOWN RIGHT INSPIRATIONAL. :handshake:
JAG, you are a modern day Deborah Sampson....:yes:

GEE THANKS, POKEY! - ....I think....WHO in the heck is Debbie Sampson? hopefully, she wasn't burned at the stake or anything like that, was she? - JAG:sweating::sweating:

[dilligaf]

Thanks for the reply. But what i get out of this is you are not the type to fight back against out of control government. That is what this thread is actually about - pointing out the flawed, short sighted DUI/ DWI/ 502 "system". Our family believes in the Constitution, and our BILL OF RIGHTS. We also understand the warnings given to us, the inheritors of this Nation, by it's FOUNDING FATHERS. WARNINGS that predict the downfall of our once great system of LIBERTY and JUSTICE FOR ALL - IF WE IGNORE THE WARNING SIGNS. There are many obvious "signs" of this said decay happening right now. It is up to us, WE THE PEOPLE, TO BE VIGILANT and FIGHT BACK. THERE ARE FIGHTERS, and then there are those who simply do nothing and stand on the sidelines while their rights slowly disappear. Which are YOU? - JAG
JAG
Because I choose not to spend my limited time, energy, and resources on every dopey, ridiculous, and yes...even infringing law our inept government enacts, it hardly qualifies me a 'sideline stander'.
Don't give up on me yet!!
Rest assured, I will be on the front lines for the 2nd Amendment battle. I will not find it in my own best interest to obey any infringing law that the incoming administration may try to shove down my throat.
I'm also quite intrigued by DaddyNeedsMils Constitution Party, and believe when the time comes, I can be an asset to that movement. Until that time, I am thankful for passionate people such as yourself that are willing to carry the mantle.
But alas, these days are spent doing what is MOST important to me right now, taking care of my aging mother and DADDY.
Continue on girlfriend, so that it is not TOO LATE when I'm able to enter the fray.

[PeggySue]

Cell phones are in the crosshairs now. If your state passes a restriction on them as a secondary offense, it will only be a year or two and you'll see cops staked out on the side of the road watching for people on their phones and nailing them. Usually at the end of the month when they're on a last minute fund raising campaign for the municipalities..

They are already doing this in Calif.

[JUSTAGIRL]

JAG
Because I choose not to spend my limited time, energy, and resources on every dopey, ridiculous, and yes...even infringing law our inept government enacts, it hardly qualifies me a 'sideline stander'.
Don't give up on me yet!!
Rest assured, I will be on the front lines for the 2nd Amendment battle. I will not find it in my own best interest to obey any infringing law that the incoming administration may try to shove down my throat.
I'm also quite intrigued by DaddyNeedsMils Constitution Party, and believe when the time comes, I can be an asset to that movement. Until that time, I am thankful for passionate people such as yourself that are willing to carry the mantle.
But alas, these days are spent doing what is MOST important to me right now, taking care of my aging mother and DADDY.
Continue on girlfriend, so that it is not TOO LATE when I'm able to enter the fray.

DADDY and I understand - carry on, we'll scream and yell extra loud for all of us - JAG:handshake::nod:

[dilligaf]

DADDY and I understand - carry on, we'll scream and yell extra loud for all of us - JAG:handshake::nod:
I'm counting on it.:yes: