Something new to think about

[granny]

Just a thought of my own. Does anyone think there may be any possibility Pres Bush may use the tax collected from our Dinars to pay off the National Debt before he leaves office? Thus leaving as one of the greatest Presidents, not what he is now. Timing would actually be good for him if the revalue was before the end of this year.

Considering a reasonable revalue, and the amount of notes there may be here in the US it could actually happen.

Wouldn't it be something if this were the plan all along. Hey, I'd go for it and pay my full share, no questions asked!

[peakoil]

Just a thought of my own. Does anyone think there may be any possibility Pres Bush may use the tax collected from our Dinars to pay off the National Debt before he leaves office? Thus leaving as one of the greatest Presidents, not what he is now. Timing would actually be good for him if the revalue was before the end of this year.

Considering a reasonable revalue, and the amount of notes there may be here in the US it could actually happen.

Wouldn't it be something if this were the plan all along. Hey, I'd go for it and pay my full share, no questions asked!

Granny, Your observation has been hashed around many times. I for one knew that the WMD's would eventually show up just as I suspect the Dinar WILL pay for this war in FULL tender. The Bush administration is a smart bunch of cookies especially Channey, they will suceed in your suggestions. One tough thing I have learned in the business world is that "Nothing is for free" Nothing. The IRS does not go after tax evaders at a loss. They too have to pay for their legal defenses and the like. The FTC does not try to indict people like Martha "Unless" they see a wind fall.

I personally think that the world (escpecially Iraqis) is better off without Saddam. People around NEED those natural resources and what a better way to pay for this gig that a nice "REVALUE JUMP". It is a win/win senario for everyone in the "Free World". Bush in so many words has already said exactly your suspicions.

I can tell you this as well: "My money is on George and I do not mean Washington".

Dinar baby!

Take Care....Peakoil

[Garym]

No I don't expect the amount of what is held by investors in the US to amount to enough money to pay back the billions of dollars the US has sent to Iraq. There would have to be trillions upon trillions of dinar in the United States. And uncle sam will only get a small portion of that you are looking at 25% max taxable dollars.
A high reval would however make the US goverment a pretty good chunk of change in taxes from us. But hardly enough to cover the cost of the war.

[iamrealdreamer]

I'm sure the US gov. has a couple hundred million Dinar laying around just waiting on George's 3 to 5 yr. plan to pay off, That my friend added with tax dollars and other kickbacks the US gov, eventually gets from the Iraqi situation will at least help quite abit. :)

[Just_Sayin]

Just a thought of my own. Does anyone think there may be any possibility Pres Bush may use the tax collected from our Dinars to pay off the National Debt before he leaves office? Thus leaving as one of the greatest Presidents, not what he is now. Timing would actually be good for him if the revalue was before the end of this year.

Considering a reasonable revalue, and the amount of notes there may be here in the US it could actually happen.

Wouldn't it be something if this were the plan all along. Hey, I'd go for it and pay my full share, no questions asked!


A beautiful thought, so let's do the math....

Let's make some assumptions:

1) A "1:1" reval happens (I'm being extremely optimistic)
2) Capital gains tax is 25%
3) The Nationall debt is 8.4T (http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/)
4) Price EVERYONE paid for 1m dinars is $675
5) NOBODODY does ANYTHING to reduce their capital gains exposure.


Ok, so with these broad assumptions, we know that:

1) At a 1:1 reval, the capital gains on every 1m dinars would be $999,325 ($1,000,000 - $675).

2) The tax on the capital gains of each 1m dinars would be $249,831.25 (25% x $999,325).

So, all you need to do is divide the national debt ($8.4T) by the tax revenue generated by each 1m dinar invested to find out how many 1m dinar investments it would take to pay off the national debt. The (rounded down) answer is: 33622695

Which means that U.S. taxpayers would need to be holding 33.6 Trillion dinar in order for it to happen (33622695 x 1,000,000). Unfortunately, that's about 3.7 times the total amount of dinar in circulation (9T), and about 2.5 times the amount of dinar actually printed (13T).

My math skills are extremely rudimentary, so if I missed on something, please correct me. But given that it is unlikely that U.S. investors are actually holding more dinars than actually exist, the idea of paying off the national debt with tax revenues on the U.S investments of dinar is beautiful, but frankly impossible. :rolleye03

Sorry!

Just_Sayin

[lab]

Bush has said several time, in previous speeches, that he intends to cut the deficit in 1/2 by the end of his term....how else would he accomplish this?

[peakoil]

No I don't expect the amount of what is held by investors in the US to amount to enough money to pay back the billions of dollars the US has sent to Iraq. There would have to be trillions upon trillions of dinar in the United States. And uncle sam will only get a small portion of that you are looking at 25% max taxable dollars.
A high reval would however make the US goverment a pretty good chunk of change in taxes from us. But hardly enough to cover the cost of the war.

Many question the US/Iraq arrangements regarding two very important elements:
1. How much NID is the US Fed holding.
2. At what rate will the FED get in return upon "cashing In holdings".

[Skillet]

Just sayin
I can agree with your thought about paying the debt off with this investment on the other hand I do se a good opportunity to pay fair amount of it.

[peakoil]

A beautiful thought, so let's do the math....

Let's make some assumptions:

1) A "1:1" reval happens (I'm being extremely optimistic)
2) Capital gains tax is 25%
3) The Nationall debt is 8.4T (http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/)
4) Price EVERYONE paid for 1m dinars is $675
5) NOBODODY does ANYTHING to reduce their capital gains exposure.


Ok, so with these broad assumptions, we know that:

1) At a 1:1 reval, the capital gains on every 1m dinars would be $999,325 ($1,000,000 - $675).

2) The tax on the capital gains of each 1m dinars would be $249,831.25 (25% x $999,325).

So, all you need to do is divide the national debt ($8.4T) by the tax revenue generated by each 1m dinar invested to find out how many 1m dinar investments it would take to pay off the national debt. The (rounded down) answer is: 33622695

Which means that U.S. taxpayers would need to be holding 33.6 Trillion dinar in order for it to happen (33622695 x 1,000,000). Unfortunately, that's about 3.7 times the total amount of dinar in circulation (9T), and about 2.5 times the amount of dinar actually printed (13T).

My math skills are extremely rudimentary, so if I missed on something, please correct me. But given that it is unlikely that U.S. investors are actually holding more dinars than actually exist, the idea of paying off the national debt with tax revenues on the U.S investments of dinar is beautiful, but frankly impossible. :rolleye03

Sorry!

Just_Sayin

The party is'nt over until the fat lady sings. The US is FAR from done (government) with the accumulation phase. We will see!

[peakoil]

A beautiful thought, so let's do the math....

Let's make some assumptions:

1) A "1:1" reval happens (I'm being extremely optimistic)
2) Capital gains tax is 25%
3) The Nationall debt is 8.4T (http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/)
4) Price EVERYONE paid for 1m dinars is $675
5) NOBODODY does ANYTHING to reduce their capital gains exposure.


Ok, so with these broad assumptions, we know that:

1) At a 1:1 reval, the capital gains on every 1m dinars would be $999,325 ($1,000,000 - $675).

2) The tax on the capital gains of each 1m dinars would be $249,831.25 (25% x $999,325).

So, all you need to do is divide the national debt ($8.4T) by the tax revenue generated by each 1m dinar invested to find out how many 1m dinar investments it would take to pay off the national debt. The (rounded down) answer is: 33622695

Which means that U.S. taxpayers would need to be holding 33.6 Trillion dinar in order for it to happen (33622695 x 1,000,000). Unfortunately, that's about 3.7 times the total amount of dinar in circulation (9T), and about 2.5 times the amount of dinar actually printed (13T).

My math skills are extremely rudimentary, so if I missed on something, please correct me. But given that it is unlikely that U.S. investors are actually holding more dinars than actually exist, the idea of paying off the national debt with tax revenues on the U.S investments of dinar is beautiful, but frankly impossible. :rolleye03

Sorry!

Just_Sayin

You missed the largest holder of all with a 100% return "UNCLE SAM"

[Just_Sayin]

...my point was that you can't hold (or accumulate) more dinar than actually exist.

Just_Sayin

[peakoil]

...my point was that you can't hold (or accumulate) more dinar than actually exist.

Just_Sayin


They will just print more. US does it all the time.

So will Iraq....

In the 11 1/2 hour Uncle Sam will secretly obtain, HUGE windfall.
The Feds have done it before, and they will do it again.

Oh Oh she just started the song and dance. RV coming.

[Just_Sayin]

Just sayin
I can agree with your thought about paying the debt off with this investment on the other hand I do se a good opportunity to pay fair amount of it.

Good point. Let's assume then that the US Govt + U.S. investors hold a whopping 25% of all dinar currently in circulation. That would be 2.25T (9T x 25%).

Holding to my previous assumptions, 2.25T dinar would mean 2,250,000 investments of 1m dinars, generating about $562.1 billion in tax revenue (2,250,000 x $249,831.25). That would represent about 6.7% of the national debt (562.1B / 8.4T).

A nice number, but not large.

Just_Sayin

[peakoil]

Good point. Let's assume then that the US Govt + U.S. investors hold a whopping 25% of all dinar currently in circulation. That would be 2.25T (9T x 25%).

Holding to my previous assumptions, 2.25T dinar would mean 2,250,000 investments of 1m dinars, generating about $562.1 billion in tax revenue (2,250,000 x $249,831.25). That would represent about 6.7% of the national debt (562.1B / 8.4T).

A nice number, but not large.

Just_Sayin


Keep printing until your figures work. That's what the Feds do.

Thanks for the help, but as usual Uncle Sam wins here too.:happy64:

[Just_Sayin]

They will just print more. US does it all the time.

So will Iraq....

In the 11 1/2 hour Uncle Sam will secretly obtain, HUGE windfall.
The Feds have done it before, and they will do it again.

Oh Oh she just started the song and dance. RV coming.

Keep printing until your figures work. That's what the Feds do.

Thanks for the help, but as usual Uncle Sam wins here too.:happy64:


Ok, I realize that if the US Govt. is holding dinars, that they will get 100% of the revenue, not 25%. However, even if the U.S. Govt. held ALL 9T dinars in circulation (impossible), then Iraq would need to print and circulate another 24T more dinars, AND the U.S. Govt. would have to control ALL of them in order to pay off the national debt.

Given the CBI is interested in currency stability, why would they MORE THAN TRIPLE the amount of currency in circulation?

"Devestating hyperinflation" anyone? :drunk:

Just_Sayin

[peakoil]

Ok, I realize that if the US Govt. is holding dinars, that they will get 100% of the revenue, not 25%. However, even if the U.S. Govt. held ALL 9T dinars in circulation (impossible), then Iraq would need to print and circulate another 24T more dinars, AND the U.S. Govt. would have to control ALL of them in order to pay off the national debt.

Given the CBI is interested in currency stability, why would they MORE THAN TRIPLE the amount of currency in circulation?

"Devestating hyperinflation" anyone? :drunk:

Just_Sayin

Sure, but then they would'nt be suspect of oil grabbing.
I know the debt is huge and your point is well taken. I just believe in Murphys Law-If it is possible then so be it.

Our government is very sharp, and one thing I have learned is this massive debt with the war is NOT free. Neither is Freedom itself. Agree.

[PennStateMtnMan]

It would be considered war profiteering.

[Skillet]

Hell, they already been there & done that , so it really would'nt matter.

[peakoil]

It would be considered war profiteering.

No it is called. "Mission Accomplished".
Time now to pull out the troops...........

We are there now.:happy64:

[PennStateMtnMan]

General Patton said "Politicians end wars to quickly, just so warriors will have to fight in another war."

[Scott Gonzales]

Many question the US/Iraq arrangements regarding two very important elements:
1. How much NID is the US Fed holding.
2. At what rate will the FED get in return upon "cashing In holdings".

I don't think the Fed holds cash (Dinar or Dollar). All of their funds are in electronic form. I could be wrong.

[Scott Gonzales]

Keep printing until your figures work. That's what the Feds do.

Thanks for the help, but as usual Uncle Sam wins here too.:happy64:

The Fed does not print money to increase the amount of Dollars in circulation. They purchase US debt (Treasury bills) from specific banks which allows them to increase the bank's electronic assets held at the Fed - presto, fiat money is created and put into circulation - it's called monetizing the debt. The Fed prints as much physical dollars as banks request from them. If bank need cash, they ask the Fed to send them the cash (as much as they want), then the Fed decreases the Bank's account held at the Fed in an amount equal to the hard currency sent to the bank.

[MEALTICKET]

A beautiful thought, so let's do the math....

Let's make some assumptions:

1) A "1:1" reval happens (I'm being extremely optimistic)
2) Capital gains tax is 25%
3) The Nationall debt is 8.4T (http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/)
4) Price EVERYONE paid for 1m dinars is $675
5) NOBODODY does ANYTHING to reduce their capital gains exposure.


Ok, so with these broad assumptions, we know that:

1) At a 1:1 reval, the capital gains on every 1m dinars would be $999,325 ($1,000,000 - $675).

2) The tax on the capital gains of each 1m dinars would be $249,831.25 (25% x $999,325).

So, all you need to do is divide the national debt ($8.4T) by the tax revenue generated by each 1m dinar invested to find out how many 1m dinar investments it would take to pay off the national debt. The (rounded down) answer is: 33622695

Which means that U.S. taxpayers would need to be holding 33.6 Trillion dinar in order for it to happen (33622695 x 1,000,000). Unfortunately, that's about 3.7 times the total amount of dinar in circulation (9T), and about 2.5 times the amount of dinar actually printed (13T).

My math skills are extremely rudimentary, so if I missed on something, please correct me. But given that it is unlikely that U.S. investors are actually holding more dinars than actually exist, the idea of paying off the national debt with tax revenues on the U.S investments of dinar is beautiful, but frankly impossible. :rolleye03

Sorry!

Just_Sayin
This quote below says to me that taxes made off the dinnar investments would not have to pay for all the deficit! That would be a great a unheard of feat if it comes true!

Bush has said several time, in previous speeches, that he intends to cut the deficit in 1/2 by the end of his term....how else would he accomplish this?

[Lux]

This quote below says to me that taxes made off the dinnar investments would not have to pay for all the deficit! That would be a great a unheard of feat if it comes true!

Bush has said several time, in previous speeches, that he intends to cut the deficit in 1/2 by the end of his term....how else would he accomplish this?
The term debt and deficit mean two different things, but commonly misunderstood.

National debt is the total amount owed - currently $8.4 trillion.

National deficit is the "rate" of debt being accumlated over the course of each year. This changes every year. In 2005 it was $550 billion.

If Bush cuts the deficit in half, we would only be going into $275 billion debt per year.

Hope this helps!

:wave:

[DinarAg]

Bush has said several time, in previous speeches, that he intends to cut the deficit in 1/2 by the end of his term....how else would he accomplish this?

The deficit and the national debt are two entirely different things.

The deficit is the shortfall between what is collected each year and what is spent.

[Coldstone]

Hey, didn't i read somewhere on this forum that the US have a nice chunk of dinar stashed? Bush did say he was going to cut the debt in half. now either he is on some serious crack, or he has a method to his madness.:shhh: my only problem is that is cost too many lives to get this done.:mad: If this hits big the first things I will do is thank God, pay my tithes, and contibute to some fund for the fallen soilders families. i have actually seen and know some of them. three from my base died a month ago from a mortar attack.:crying: i digress. it is all coming together now, the muddy picture is coming clear.